Searching for NINO pt 2

Last week, I telephoned Her Majestys Revenue and Customs department (HMRC) yet again. Once again, I spoke to an Advisor at a Call Centre, had to repeat the information I had shared on previous occasions about trying to locate my late mothers’ National Insurance Number (NINO)  and eventually was put through to the named person who was dealing with my request.

At last! I thought I had made progress as the Adviosr I spoke to confirmed he had received my written request, had sent a letter in the post and told me to ignore it as communication appeared to have crossed over.
Then, he asked me to confirm details all over again. I was beginning to see red, frustrated at the lack of information given and the repeated questions and answers. I explained several times the reason for my request and the Advisor said he had to pull my letter out in front of him to confirm who I was and cross reference the verbal information with the written communication.
He asked if I was the Executor of the Will, a legal representative or the Administrator? Unfortunately, I had to say neither. He apologised and said that due to the Data Protection Act and the nature of the request, he could not pass on my mothers NINO unless I held any of those roles and responsibilties and could I not obtain that information or consent from the aforementioned? If I could do that, I said, I wouldn’t be wasting my time contacting the HMRC!

So, after trying to request a NINO for several months and negotiate a way forward, I am still left high and dry. Surely I’m not the only person in the UK who is experiencing this difficulty in trying to obtain the NINO for my deceased parent for legitimate reasons? The Advisor at the other end of the phone made every effort to be understanding and in a hushed tone of voice said that that was one of the most common problems faced by people writing in and “people don’t realise the importance of having or knowing their parents National Insurance Number until it’s too late!”

I was provided with the option of speaking to his Supervisor but was told it would be breaching the Data Protection Act if they were to provide me with the relevant number. I ended the call knowing that I had gone full circle on my quest and achieved nothing more than gleaning a new piece of information regarding the protocol of NINOs. I thought there may be a loophole in the legal sytem to make it easier to gain or access a simple number but that is closed. As far as I am aware, the HMRC & NMTS are watertight when it comes to issues and the Data Protection Act.

The link below (which  I found earlier today) provides further useful advice, information & guidance:
http://www.probatewizard.co.uk/guides/how-to-find-deceaseds-national…

The following steps have been copied and pasted from that particular website:

How to request a deceased person’s National Insurance number from HMRC:

1. The executor of the will, or the next of kin, should send a written request to the following address:
   Non-match Tracing Section      BP1201      HM Revenue & Customs      NICO      Long Benton      Newcastle-upon-Tyne      NE98 122
2. In the letter, state the following:      – the deceased’s full name, address and date of birth;      – your relationship to the deceased (executor or next of kin);      – your own National Insurance number to confirm your identity; and      – the reason for your request (for example, you are dealing with the probate process and the number is required to complete certain forms).
3. Enclose the original – or certified copy – death certificate or grant of probate.

But I would say that where it states Next of Kin, remove that and replace it with ” Administrator of the deceased’s estate or the person that dealt with the affairs of the deceased’s estate”.

 

The Learned Kat

Searching for NINO

Last September, I was asked by my solicitor to supply him with information concerning my late mothers estate. He required a copy of her 1. death certificate 2. her National Insurance Number (NINO) and 3. the value of the estate she left behind.
To obtain item 1 was easy. I just had to write to the Registrar Office and enclose a cheque for £10 and within several weeks, I received a copy.
To obtain item 3 would not be a challenge and I assume it would be easy. All I need to do is contact an Estate Agent.

But to obtain item 2? The NINO has been very stressful.

First of all I telephoned the Department of Work and Pensions (DWP). I spoke to one of the Advisors and explained the situation. She advised that I submit a copy of my mothers’ death certificate and request her NINO. It shouldn’t be a problem, she added. I clarified the postal address. She reiterated it would not be a problem. So I wrote a letter and addressed it to the DWP. I waited 2 weeks. I waited 4 weeks. Eventually, after waiting 8 weeks, I telephoned the DWP and explained that I had spoke to an Advisor back in Septemeber, I had written a letter and had not received response.

“Can I take your details please?” asked the Advisor. So I provided my own personal details again, including the date of birth and death of my mother, her home address and and the reason why I needed her NINO. “Sorry, but we don’t have any details or information on our database that we’ve received any correspondence. Can you send it out again and ensure that it’s posted by recorded delivery?” I was exasperated and agreed to send a written request out again. It cost me about £3 but I thought it was worth it. I waited patiently for the relevant documents and NINO to arrive. I waited and waited.

Christmas came and went. Then the New Year arrived and a couple of days later, I telephoned the DWP once more.
I found myself repeating all that I had said on the previous occasions.
“I would like my late mothers National Insurance number please…”
“I’m sorry but who is the deceased again?”
“My mother”
“And how are you related?”
“I’m not being funny”, I said “but if she is my mother, what does that make me!?”
The Advisor took a moment to consider and said “the son!? Yes, of course you are! I’m sorry but you’ve written to the wrong department. You need to write to Her Majestys Revenue and Customs (HMRC) as we dont’t deal with National Insurance Numbers!”
By this time, I was exasperated and asked for the appropriate address and telephone number. She duly obliged, and we ended the call.

I phoned HMRC.
The first words that were spoken by a deep male voice was “We don’t give out National Insurance Numbers!”
What a way to greet someone, I thought. Whatever happened to “Hello/Good Afternoon.  How can I help you?”

I had to jump in quick with “Can you allow me to explain myself first…” and then provided background information as to how and why I had to contact the HMRC. Then, when all was said and done, he placed me on hold, and put me through to one of their internal departments.  I spoke  briefly to another advisor, who, in turn, asked me to hold and put me through to yet another advisor. By this time, I really was a broken record.

Eventually, this particular Advisor sounded empathetic and explained to me that  due to my postcode being different to my mothers home address, information passed on would be difficult to ascertain and due to data protection, the NINO could not be divulged over the phone and could I write in? I didn’t want to argue. so I acquiesced and said my request will be in the post as advised. “You need to address it to the Individual Case Worker Section”, he said and assured me that it would be dealt with promptly.

Three weeks later, as I still hadn’t heard anything, I called again. After being placed on hold several times and having to listen to irritating background muzak, I was handed over to a named person who said he would look into my case and would phone me back within 10 minutes. He did this and then suggested that I write or fax him details again. Even then, he conceded that I may not be able to have my mothers’ NINO as I was not her legal representative nor did I represent her estate.

I explained that I knew that if I had access to her pension book, bank accounts or correspondence from the Council e.g. Council Tax bill, Care fees etc then I would be able to find her NINO. I would not be calling HMRC for nothing and was looking for information as requested by my solicitor.

Once again he asked me to address the letter to his office and he would personally deal with my request. All I had to do was await the written outcome!

I didn’t think it would be so difficult to obtain a vital piece of personal information albeit not mine but my mums and for a very legitimate reason.

Has anyone else experienced similar problems or issues?

The Learned Kat